FsN and the Stopping Power stigma

[drinksabit]

To the original poster...Mozambique Drill!
The FN 5.7 is ideal for doing the Mozambique Drill.

+1

[blueorison]

From 20 feet you can triple tap into someone's head.

[Robar]

From 20 feet you can triple tap into someone's head.

That should do it.

[grew]

Time for my rant. I went to the public range today because my Private club wont' let me shoot Five Seven indoors. Had a blast shooting my PS90 and Five Seven and at the end when I was packing up this guy and his wife come over to me and he says "Is that a PS90 I saw you shooting?" So of course I get mildly excited as they are rare in The Socialist Republic of Massachusetts. As soon as I am about to start telling him about it he follows up with "too bad the ammo has no stopping power" so I calmly take a deep breath and explain to him that there are non-lame rounds made by a certain manufacturer in Illinois. He basically stars going off about bullet weight being the be all end all of ballistics and then says the most ridiculous line. "I train in only one system and I train hard". By then I took an even bigger breath, and said "I shoot for fun and there is nothing more fun than the five seven platform in my opinion". I was so pissed but didn't want to start in on him about it. Not more than 2 minutes earlier we were doing a timed firing contest with 50 foot 22 rifle targets (A32) at 40 feet and I had 6 bullseyes in just under 3 seconds. I am by no means a good shooter and only recently got into firearms but I can't think of another weapon I could do that with.....

anyway I have learned to just listen to the following flowchart when dealing with these people

[Valorius]

There are some extremely devastating rounds for the Five Seven. Anyone that says they're isn't is either ill informed, or has an agenda.

A 40gr V-max at 2000fps is going to light a person up bad, and that's just the basic round.

[Ulysses38]

Nice flowchart :thumb:

[blueorison]

Grew, you are right on the money.

For those who are close-minded and do not wish to be educated, just smile, and walk away.

It is not worth it.

Trust me. I'm on the range at least once a week.

[Davidlee]

I've lived for a while and wish I'd had this chart 30 years ago. Good deal.

[fatherfoof]

1. Turn on the lights.
2. When they see what I look like before fully awake, they flee in terror for having met the creature from the dark lagoon.
3. If I am awake, I'm uglier.

[Ospy]

1. Turn on the lights.
2. When they see what I look like before fully awake, they flee in terror for having met the creature from the dark lagoon.
3. If I am awake, I'm uglier.

Nice. Me, I inflate my lungs to make myself appear larger.

[retirednak]

Some asked about stopping power. Last winter, a 1200 pound moose cow was hit by a car,she was still standing up but had a broken leg. No way would she survive. State Troopers or Fish & Feather usually put the moose down. The Troopers were going to be busy for the next couple hrs,I couldn't see the moose suffering that long. I was able to drop the moose with one shot and fired a second shot once down to make sure she was down for good. I was surprised the moose went down on the first shot and I'm pretty sure she was dead before firing the second round.

I now feel comfortable enough to carry my Five Seven full time.

[Ospy]

Some asked about stopping power. Last winter, a 1200 pound moose cow was hit by a car,she was still standing up but had a broken leg. No way would she survive. State Troopers or Fish & Feather usually put the moose down. The Troopers were going to be busy for the next couple hrs,I couldn't see the moose suffering that long. I was able to drop the moose with one shot and fired a second shot once down to make sure she was down for good. I was surprised the moose went down on the first shot and I'm pretty sure she was dead before firing the second round.

I now feel comfortable enough to carry my Five Seven full time.

I don't doubt, but it IS a little unbelievable. Wow! I almost need to see it

[retirednak]

Since the cow had been hit by the car,she was far from healthy to begin with. A shot to the head shouldn't be hard to believe.

[Valorius]

A shot to the head on a moose killing it instantly should be totally believable. The 5.7 is afterall known for tremendous penetration of hard barriers (like a moose skull)

[flyingirish04]

Especially if the trooper was carrying ss190.

[ShockedNKansas]

Especially if the trooper was carrying ss190.

Retirednak said nothing about being a trooper. In fact, his following quote kind of implies he's not:

State Troopers or Fish & Feather usually put the moose down. The Troopers were going to be busy for the next couple hrs,I couldn't see the moose suffering that long. I was able to drop the moose with one shot...

I would ASSume he does not carry ss190 and more likely carries 195 or 197 unless he has secured la prima from EA.

[ShockedNKansas]

I was so pissed but didn't want to start in on him about it.

grew, you shouldn't let things like that piss you off. Your anger points to a possible insecurity you have about the round. If you know you are right, then you should be laughing at his ignorance. No need to offer the excuse that you just "shoot for fun" to try and placate him. Be strong and confident and tell him it is a devastating round and he should spend more time doing research before he tries to debate the issue.

If you still feel intimidated by such conversations, go ahead and pick up a .45 and now you own big caliber and small caliber and you can tell the next guy, "hey, I own a .45 but I choose to carry the 5.7". :thumb:

[Valorius]

Just remember Five Seven guys....

[grew]

I was so pissed but didn't want to start in on him about it.

grew, you shouldn't let things like that piss you off. Your anger points to a possible insecurity you have about the round. If you know you are right, then you should be laughing at his ignorance. No need to offer the excuse that you just "shoot for fun" to try and placate him. Be strong and confident and tell him it is a devastating round and he should spend more time doing research before he tries to debate the issue.

If you still feel intimidated by such conversations, go ahead and pick up a .45 and now you own big caliber and small caliber and you can tell the next guy, "hey, I own a .45 but I choose to carry the 5.7". :thumb:

I wasn't really pissed at him I was pissed about the fact I thought i was going to be talking to someone who really enjoyed talking about guns and instead ended up with a conversation about "stopping power". As for shooting for fun it wasn't really an excuse but the truth. I am certainly not going to be the one leading the pack when the zombie apocalypse happens. I'll just be the guy with all the guns and ammo. I don't pretend to be in the military as there are better men than I serving/have served our country that chose to do that. Shooting is a fun hobby and stress reliever from my day job.

Basically I over exaggerated my responses a tad bit (but isn't that what you do on the internet?)

[Adjuster]

I'm brand new here, but am also tired of the stopping power debate.

It is a relentless bovine scatoria spewing diatribe that makes the owners of .45's happy to be the big dogs in the debate.

What I find amusing is often the guys who say it all falls to caliber and bullet weight, are often the ones with poor shot groups, and really need to train the most to actually use what they have.

I own a few 9mm pistols, and even a carbine, and especially on the carbine, I get the "stopping power" debate nearly every time I show up at the range with that weapon.

The 5.7 round is/was designed to replace and upgrade the 9x19mm round that has proven leathal for tens of thousands. The reality is, the 5.7 round improves on the positive aspects of the 9x19mm design, and has no downside that I can see.

As mentioned by another here, If I wanted to carry a .45, I have one, and could choose it easy. But I like the 9mm or now the FN5.7.