FiveSeven Problems....

Discuss the FN Five-seveN line of pistols and accessories.

Moderator: blueorison

User avatar
gw45acp
Gold Member
Posts: 832
Joined: 21 Aug 2008, 06:17
Location: Utah

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by gw45acp » 20 May 2009, 21:26

I tried to duplicate this and I couldn't get it to occur. I can see that it comes close, but the bullet tip doesn't quite touch the spring.
"How the Hell did I get here?"

apache
Member
Posts: 323
Joined: 22 Dec 2008, 09:36

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by apache » 21 May 2009, 07:49

So this issue had me thinking, so I looked into it with my 57 Took some pictures as well.

First pic is how far I started with the round sticking out of the mag:
Image

Sorry for the focus issues, I could not get my camera to focus down into the mag well.
This is the first step with above mag inserted into mag well
Image

This is round dropped into opening @ mag catch
Image

This is the round where it could catch the spring. notice is does not catch
Image

This is just a normal mag spring:
Image


excuse all the crap in my frame, I have not noticed it with the naked eye.. under magnification you can really see how dirty it is... :(

I could not duplicate your issue in about 10-15 try's.. every time I tried the round would glided past the spring without catching it.

My questions are: is your mag spring bent so that it sticks out farther into the mag well than normal? if so or not..maybe try putting a slight bend in yours so that it sits as close to the wall in the spring channel as possible. And does this happen with all your mags? I would think a week mag spring may allow your first round to move more than it should.

Lastly, I would suggest changing your reload routine to include a quick slap of the mag to re-seat all rounds to the back of the mag. (I got in the habit of always slapping my mags, before putting them in the weapon, in the Army and its habit for me now)
But a Constitution of Government once changed from Freedom, can never be restored. Liberty, once lost, is lost forever.
John Adams, July 17, 1775

allena2s2
Junior Member
Posts: 9
Joined: 19 Nov 2008, 11:11

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by allena2s2 » 21 May 2009, 17:02

I have no problem duplicating this in both mine. You are not doing it correctly.

To exaggerate the situation so you know what I am talking about:

Pull the round out about .150" more than you are now.
Now insert the magazine with the bullet tip going in first, then rotate it rearward (Like putting a mag in an AK-47). The bullet will contact the inside of the magwell and tilt up a few degrees (It will not come out of the magazine, but just tip up a bit) as you rotate the magazine rearward in order to get the correct mag alighnment to insert the mag fully. Now when the bullet passes the mag catch it will rotate back down to level when it passes the void in the plastic there. Then it will catch the spring every time.

As far as those who say "the bullet would never move that much forward":

Take your loaded magazine and hit it in the palm of your hand like you are tring to
shake a round out the front. Note how little force it takes to move the round the needed ammount that would create this malfunction. Not much at all, much less than dropping one on the ground, or quickly snatching one out of a mag pouch (I figured this was likely when mine were moving) would be....

Grantness
Senior Member
Posts: 4681
Joined: 19 Aug 2008, 09:13
Location: Virginia

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by Grantness » 21 May 2009, 18:05

I dont see how you could do this without banging it up against something. I have never seen this happen until just now, banging it on my knee. Its never happened to me in the course of daily use.

I tried dropping it several times, and could not replicate it. Im sure it could happen, but it would be very random.
That being said, couldnt that happen to just about any mag if you dropped it just so? If a round sticks out far enough, the mag isnt going to fit into any gun. I know the bullet catching the mag spring is a bit of a design flaw, but if it were sticking out much further, the mag wouldnt fit in the gun at all.

apache
Member
Posts: 323
Joined: 22 Dec 2008, 09:36

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by apache » 21 May 2009, 19:50

I am not saying you are not having an issue, only that I could not duplicate it. Trust me, I tried this with the round further out than in the pic and many variations in between. I even tried to move the round into the void when the mag was half way in. Every time the round would get pinched, then as I forced the mag in, the round would be pushed back into the mag to the point it would not catch the spring.

My advice is posted above, other than that contact Bob Ailes @ FNUSA
But a Constitution of Government once changed from Freedom, can never be restored. Liberty, once lost, is lost forever.
John Adams, July 17, 1775

moreland281
Junior Member
Posts: 54
Joined: 10 May 2009, 10:10

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by moreland281 » 22 May 2009, 06:27

Dang, thats not good, I want to carry one as well.

brw0044
Junior Member
Posts: 32
Joined: 26 May 2009, 12:32

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by brw0044 » 27 May 2009, 12:35

This could be an issue in a bind. But I agree that the easy remedy would be to make sure the round isn't sticking out when you put the mag in the gun. Also, if you carry the five seven with a 20rd mag loaded - then technically the failure wouldn't occur until you put the second mag in with the protruding round -- in which case you have already fired 20rds and must be in one helluva gun fight....or one helluva poor shot.

atomicat
Junior Member
Posts: 2
Joined: 28 Sep 2010, 18:30

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by atomicat » 28 Sep 2010, 19:41

I have a FiveSeven. At times I carry it as a car protection weapon, or as backup. It's not my primary weapon. I think of it, when it's being fired as perhaps the perfect handgun, almost a dream handgun, that is the gun a person imagines a gun would be like when they are a kid. It has a lot of noise and almost no kick, with great followup shot capability, making it truly a fearful weapon to behold and to fire. To me it feels a bit uncomfortable and square, but when you fire it, of course all Five Seven owners know that it's more like a weapon out of the future, than something you'd think of as a current weapon.

SPRING FALLING OUT - IT HAPPENED TO ME TONIGHT
I had the same problem but I noticed a bullet way out and tried to put it in before seating it. It caught it and the spring fell out.

I have to figure out exactly how the spring goes back into the Five Seven, these pictures help.

I'm not a LAO (police officer, etc) and I don't have a lot of experience tearing down guns or putting them back together. I'm not a hunter, just a CPL holder. Any hints on getting the spring back in? Or should I just take it into the dealer and let them figure it out. I don't want to rush and break something.

My point is: I foolishly tried to see if it would seat the mag inside the weapon and knew that the bullet was out a ways. I wanted to see if it would seat inside the gun as I put the bullet in and rushed and it was put in wrong. I just stuck the mag in quickly and it wasn't seated correctly and tried to put the mag into the five seven and it happened. It must be if the bullet is in far enough out it can catch and it obviously doesn't stop the mag from being loaded into the gun.

Actually I was unloading the weapon and put the full mag into the gun with a bullet mis-seated to pull the trigger with no bullets in the chamber, just to release the firing pin when this happened. There's probably a better way and a safer way to release the firing pin, (Maybe a dummy round in an empty clip or something for those really worried about safety issues . . .

MORE ABOUT ME - THIS IS MY FIRST POST on Five Seven.
I carry sometimes with the round chambered as many of course would. The Five Seven worries me a bit with it's unconventional safety. I wonder if the safety could easily be pushed off or switch off without really knowing it and the short trigger pull then could cause problems. I also wonder if I'd be practiced enough to not run into problems with that if the SHTF in a shootout. Sometimes I don't have a round chambered as I have one in my primary and other times I have one chambered. This might be a bad habit for carrying, but I usually think of it as a tactical backup and plan when I may need it to have a round in the chamber. I fear more of the gun going off by accident than my needing it for defense. Statistics might prove accidental discharges happen more often than defensive needs, I don't know, it's just a gut feeling I have and I know I should control the safety of the weapon and as a tactical defense weapon (for certain situations) it doesn't always need a round in the chamber (as a second weapon.) That's my practicing theory anyway. . .

I carry an XD as my primary weapon and there is no safety to deal with on the XD. And frankly I like the extra weight of the XD barrel when shooting at a range with typical CCW type shooting exercises. (Different than tactical)

I love the Five Seven, but don't shoot it enough for it to be my primary weapon. I might never shoot it well enough or consider it small enough for it to be my primary weapon.

I like the weight, the frames a little large of course. And for some (like me) the weight might be a little light to have the accuracy you want when shooting. I'm not as good a tactical shooter as many others I've seen at the range who have years and years experience. Each handgun has it's traits I suppose. I found it accurate when I first shot it, but don't shoot enough IDA (or whatever the abreviation?) meets and practice enough with it to make it the most accurate weapon for me. (The error is with me and my lack of practice than the trigger of course, I may not brace myself enough or use firm enough holding techniques to keep it on target and as steady as I would hope to.) I wouldn't put some kind of fancy light trigger job on it either, but that's just me because I'd be afraid of setting off a light triggered weapon that I carry to easily.) I find it's frame is a bit light and more easy to pull off target with a squeeze of the trigger compared to a heavier handgun. Maybe the light frame weight is more of a negative for me.

I think about having it in cases where I might need a round(s) with a little more penetration, outdoors in some situations. I don't imagine to many scenarios when I'd need it, it seems more like a tactical gun for LAO than a civilian carry sidearm in my opinion, just my opinion. The reason I state this is it seems like the round would have more penetration and if I was to use it in a defensive situation, I'd think that it would possibly go through the assailant and possibly hit some other person further down range. Of course that would always be a situation that could happen but hopefully less with some of the other rounds.

I think about it more as an "anti car jacking weapon" in the case where someone might try to car jack my vehicle and I'd have to shoot through a window at them or something, which I would hate to do of course. I don't even know if having one would be of any advantage in most robbery situations (meaning any gun) if the robber has his gun drawn and on you. Most talk about a gun for defense could be more talk than based on experiencing reality. . . I'm getting off the subject now and I know all the arguments for being armed and having something rather than nothing when you need something. Most of the times, bad situations can be avoided with common sense and intuition sizing up and avoiding bad situations. Using our brain instead of a handgun of course. . .

There have been some car jackers that were very bold and it's difficult to say in those situations if a person even with a CPL could draw and get into an exchange, depending on the "drop" the car thief would have on the driver. But such talk is perhaps more speculation than anything. Anyway I think of it as a car weapon and one I would be very reluctant to deploy because of it's penetration characteristics. I'd rather have a different weapon for self defense on my body for first draw up close situations. The follow up capability of the Five Seven and the feel of it when firing it won me over. It's got such a low level of kick and such a high rate of fire, it probably can't be beat in some situations, but I don't know if it would be useful in many close range encounters on the street.

To me, and this is just me, I think it would be something I'd deploy as a last case emergency weapon, if my primary weapon didn't seem to be the weapon of choice and I had time to deploy it. Even saying this, makes it seem to me like a tactical weapon, something that a police officer might use, rather than a CPL holder. Sorry for the theory, I'm sure there are a lot of other theories out there and many with more experience and training than I've had who carry it tactically or as a CCW weapon. It's lightness of course is amazing for carrying, it's loudness and flash of the mussel makes it seem to be something that would be horrible to have to shoot indoors in home defense situations as well, because it would likely deafen the family members and I don't know how safe a 5.7 would be flying through a person, a door or wall and perhaps through a neighbors wall as well.

(Also take into consideration that I'm talking about hopefully a very rare situation, and not attempting to get into the typical range brag fest of what I can or would do, that sometimes we hear at ranges. In most cases the best thing to do is find a way out of a situation and carrying a weapon actually makes a person more wary of confrontations or getting involved in some situation that might result in problems that could escalate.) I think most CPL holders, or at least some bragging at ranges at times, can get into an imaginary bragfest of what could happen and what they would do in a tactical situation, and in a real crime scene or crime thing happening, things are so fluid, you don't even have time to get involved or follow or run around and get a good handle of what is going on, much less decide to deploy a weapon. I've been in bad parts of some towns and actually ended up rushing away from crazy street people as if I was in fear of them, but I was more in fear of the crazy confrontation and having a gun that that might become a necessary thing that would be deployed to avoid some crazy action. They thought I was running from them, but I was running from a situation that would put them in great potential threat of force. (This sounds strange, and maybe I'm tired as I write this, do you know what I mean? I'm talking about avoiding conflict.) With crazy folks shooting in inner cities at night randomly and drug dealers, gang bangers and criminals running around with pit bulls (a poor mans gun), it seems like there are a lot of crazy places out there, and the best defence is to avoid those bad times and locations in the first place.

Okay I went off topic a bit, I just wanted to add a little on my thoughts of this as a weapon. It seems to me to be better for some specifics but not perhaps for all situations. So to sum it up I seldom carry it, and when I do it's for certain specific possible threats that might occur. It might be better as an outdoor carry weapon in the woods, than something you'd have on you in a crowded eatery. Most of the time I think and I train myself to rely on the other weapon of choice for defensive situations, an XD.

Okay enough of my basic theory on why I carry it as a secondary weapon, when I have it. I've heard rave reviews from some about this weapon. These seem to me to be more geared toward thinking of it as a tactical weapon or LAO types.

atomicat
Junior Member
Posts: 2
Joined: 28 Sep 2010, 18:30

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by atomicat » 28 Sep 2010, 20:03

Also consider this, one fire fight in Florida was some kind of foreign drug hit or something in Florida some years back. In that "shootout" two hitmen had a rented van filled with weapons and they kept shooting at the targets in some strip mall, emptying each gun and throwing it aside before grabbing another one. They had shot so many rounds off, "it was like a war" according to the commentary I saw on a TV show that talked about this. During the drug problems in Florida in the 80's if I recall correctly. They talked about how these two hitmen had these weapons and a vehicle that could not be traced back to them and they were likely some kind of outside hit man from out of the USA hired by drug lords or some criminal enterprise, so kind of inside drug hit.

They described on some TV show how all these rounds were going off and the two guys these two were after were dead in the strip mall and the shooters got away. I thought to myself, wow that had to be one heck of a fire fight. And then they said, 78 shots were fired, because of course shell casings were left behind and all the weapons used seemed to be ejecting shells. . . semi autos, etc. When they said 78 shots were fired I exclaimed heck I almost carry that many rounds myself at times, 78 rounds seems like nothing.


This to me shows that a typical CPL holder after hearing and watching all the hype and talk about having enough ammo, training at the range, etc. We can perhaps go overboard and think we will need all those clips and rounds. . . I guess having to many is better than not enough if you're ever in a shootout. But in truth, most shootouts probably have far fewer rounds required as we can see with the example of the "war" like footage. In a real war, the amount of shell casings is much more terrifying from what I've seen on TV or heard. It's in a different league. But TV shows mentioned this as a "war" according to LAO interviewed if I recall the show correctly. So this means, most of the time, 20 rounds will likely be more than enough and a five seven user will likely never chamber another clip in the middle of a firefight. If you're lucky, statistics state that you're rare encounter will likely involve having to display a weapon to get a desired effect at stopping a problem. I could probably carry my Five Seven without a spring and one mag loaded in it and that would be sufficient. But I'm not going to carry it with a spring missing from the mag release lever.

User avatar
flyingirish04
Gold Member
Posts: 4783
Joined: 25 Aug 2008, 21:42
custom title: Mtn Man in Flatland
Location: Great Plains, USA

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by flyingirish04 » 29 Sep 2010, 05:00

wow. just wow.
Killed Two Stones with One Bird.

User avatar
f3rr37
Site Admin
Posts: 14670
Joined: 19 Aug 2008, 12:09

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by f3rr37 » 29 Sep 2010, 08:00

flyingirish04 wrote:wow. just wow.
You took the words right out of my mouth. :)

User avatar
buckett
Junior Member
Posts: 248
Joined: 08 Jun 2010, 10:31
custom title: Firefighter
Location: Northern Illinois

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by buckett » 02 Oct 2010, 08:28

Took the words right out of my mouth...
My goal in life: To be the next John Moses Browning.

It takes 43 muscles to frown... 17 muscles to smile... But only 3 for a proper trigger squeeze.

Seahawk
Junior Member
Posts: 13
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 13:09

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by Seahawk » 13 Oct 2010, 11:48

I was having the same problem with my FS..see this post, if you scroll down I took a picture with the newly designed mag release retention spring, that FN installed in my pistol. You may need to call Bob back a couple of times, but he will get back to ( I think ). They did fix my gun and then I recieved a nice tshirt and hat from Bob. If you look at the new spring you can tell that it's bent at the top and they no longer use paper clips.

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=8223" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

User42
Senior Member
Posts: 752
Joined: 29 Sep 2008, 20:22

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by User42 » 13 Oct 2010, 13:24

Awesome posts atomicat, but you went so far off topic you might want to consider splitting your posts into different threads so people can respond without cluttering this one up. I'm probably going to call Bob and get one of those beefed up magazine catch springs in Seahawk's thread. Keep in mind you can also get extra magazine catches for when yours wear out, they are like 50 or 75 cents. A full set of black or grey controls costs less than 10 bucks if you want to change the color, and he has no problem shipping them for you.

As for the carjacking scenario, your right in the sense that if someone appears at your window unexpected with a weapon drawn, you really would have no chance at getting to yours if they are ready and willing to shoot. In that case it would probably be safer to tell him have fun, it's insured. I wonder if you could legally shoot your own tires out before he drives away? Probably not, especially if you are inside city limits, but it would be pretty amusing. I'm about to design my own alarm system and I will probably include a descrete killswitch to disable it if I felt like it. That, and I always keep enough room between my car and the one ahead of me that I could pull away if I wanted. My car will get to 40 in a hurry if I want it to. Also keep in mind guns are effective, but a car is really a much bigger weapon when it comes down to it.

Lol on that note, and going even more off topic, I was driving through a crappy neighborhood side streets one day when I came across some "thugs" playing basketball in the street. I stopped, they didn't move. I honked, they looked, but continued playing. I honked again, and a few threw their hands up like gorillas, kinda pushing their chest out and acting like they wanted to fight, and started walking towards my car. Without even thinking about it I barked my tires like I was going to run them over (but without actually going anywere) and you better believe they got the hell out of the way. I wouldn't have actually hit them if they had to balls to keep coming, I would have just threw my car in reverse and went another way, but I'll be damned if I'm going to get out of my car to fight some idiots that don't realize that I have the right to drive down any public road I please.
If a man dedicates his life to good deeds and the welfare of others, He will die unthanked and unremembered. If he exercises his genius bringing death and misery to billions, his name will echo down through the millennia for a hundred lifetimes.

User avatar
blueorison
Competition/Training Mod
Posts: 10665
Joined: 11 Apr 2009, 14:28
custom title: UT/EA Pistol Captain
Contact:

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by blueorison » 13 Oct 2010, 14:25

User42 wrote:
Lol on that note, and going even more off topic, I was driving through a crappy neighborhood side streets one day when I came across some "thugs" playing basketball in the street. I stopped, they didn't move. I honked, they looked, but continued playing. I honked again, and a few threw their hands up like gorillas, kinda pushing their chest out and acting like they wanted to fight, and started walking towards my car. Without even thinking about it I barked my tires like I was going to run them over (but without actually going anywere) and you better believe they got the hell out of the way. I wouldn't have actually hit them if they had to balls to keep coming, I would have just threw my car in reverse and went another way, but I'll be damned if I'm going to get out of my car to fight some idiots that don't realize that I have the right to drive down any public road I please.
Good story. I would have just pointed in direction of the closest police station and yelled "HOLY CRAP OBAMA IS WALKING DOWN THE STREET!".

And watch the monkeys run towards the bananas.
Never attribute to malice that which can be explained by stupidity.
The shooter will always matter more than the gear ever will.
Stop relying on others to do the work for you.
Shoot more, worry less.

s-industries
Gold Member
Posts: 288
Joined: 19 Nov 2008, 20:31
custom title: M.E.
Location: Nac

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by s-industries » 13 Oct 2010, 18:25

I replicated this after three tries using 195's. At first I thought it couldn't happen because the round would hit a plastic lip that was at the bottom of the spring cavity between the "divider" (piece of vertical plastic that is in the middle of the spring cavity). This lip would not allow the mag to be inserted with a round protruding, and if the round were in far enough to miss the lip, it couldn't contact the spring. After I actually inserted the mag like I would at full speed, that little lip broke through. I realized that it is probably just 'flash' left over from molding the frame. Now it would be possible for me to have the same failure that started this thread. Look at Apache's last picture. Look on the right side of the divider at the bottom and you can see that the lip on his gun has been partially broken.

My suggestion is to take the spring out and bend the curve on the left side so that it actually hooks into the mag release. I haven't tried this (yet) so I don't know what the end result will be. I think that this will prevent the spring from being pushed out.

If that doesn't work I would try the wedge. Put it right down there where the lip used to be.

User42
Senior Member
Posts: 752
Joined: 29 Sep 2008, 20:22

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by User42 » 14 Oct 2010, 06:21

blueorison wrote:
User42 wrote:
Lol on that note, and going even more off topic, I was driving through a crappy neighborhood side streets one day when I came across some "thugs" playing basketball in the street. I stopped, they didn't move. I honked, they looked, but continued playing. I honked again, and a few threw their hands up like gorillas, kinda pushing their chest out and acting like they wanted to fight, and started walking towards my car. Without even thinking about it I barked my tires like I was going to run them over (but without actually going anywere) and you better believe they got the hell out of the way. I wouldn't have actually hit them if they had to balls to keep coming, I would have just threw my car in reverse and went another way, but I'll be damned if I'm going to get out of my car to fight some idiots that don't realize that I have the right to drive down any public road I please.
Good story. I would have just pointed in direction of the closest police station and yelled "HOLY CRAP OBAMA IS WALKING DOWN THE STREET!".

And watch the monkeys run towards the bananas.
This was pre Obama you goof. And they weren't black...
If a man dedicates his life to good deeds and the welfare of others, He will die unthanked and unremembered. If he exercises his genius bringing death and misery to billions, his name will echo down through the millennia for a hundred lifetimes.

User avatar
blueorison
Competition/Training Mod
Posts: 10665
Joined: 11 Apr 2009, 14:28
custom title: UT/EA Pistol Captain
Contact:

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by blueorison » 14 Oct 2010, 15:51

User42 wrote:
blueorison wrote:
User42 wrote:
Lol on that note, and going even more off topic, I was driving through a crappy neighborhood side streets one day when I came across some "thugs" playing basketball in the street. I stopped, they didn't move. I honked, they looked, but continued playing. I honked again, and a few threw their hands up like gorillas, kinda pushing their chest out and acting like they wanted to fight, and started walking towards my car. Without even thinking about it I barked my tires like I was going to run them over (but without actually going anywere) and you better believe they got the hell out of the way. I wouldn't have actually hit them if they had to balls to keep coming, I would have just threw my car in reverse and went another way, but I'll be damned if I'm going to get out of my car to fight some idiots that don't realize that I have the right to drive down any public road I please.
Good story. I would have just pointed in direction of the closest police station and yelled "HOLY CRAP OBAMA IS WALKING DOWN THE STREET!".

And watch the monkeys run towards the bananas.
This was pre Obama you goof. And they weren't black...
Oh. In any case, I didn't say they were black... did I :D

It doesn't matter, even if they weren't aware of Obama and what he stood for at the time, they still don't and aren't, now. haha
Never attribute to malice that which can be explained by stupidity.
The shooter will always matter more than the gear ever will.
Stop relying on others to do the work for you.
Shoot more, worry less.

Never Enough
Junior Member
Posts: 21
Joined: 22 Apr 2010, 11:46

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by Never Enough » 17 Oct 2010, 15:58

allena2s2 i agree with you 100%, how can you depend on a fire arm that falls apart , jams , and wears out so quickly. How could you you possibly use it as your go to gun ? With so many complaints ? I love the five seven , the shape ,the ammo, the whole concept of this firearm is great, would i trust my life or my familys life ? NO WAY ! ..... I have had these problems my self, I do depend on my other firearms, I really like and depend on my Springfield Armory X D M 45 A C P wow what a firearm to brag on !

User avatar
panzermk2
Forum Supporter
Posts: 11862
Joined: 19 Aug 2008, 15:51
Location: Around here it's more like what can we shoot through next.
Contact:

Re: FiveSeven Problems....

Post by panzermk2 » 17 Oct 2010, 17:18

Never Enough wrote:allena2s2 i agree with you 100%, how can you depend on a fire arm that falls apart , jams , and wears out so quickly. !

Sorry calling [email protected] on that one. I have over 40k in loads hotter then you can imagine and it is going strong.

Vitaliy though at over 100k has had his frame where out. So what junk frame only lasted 100k

I have had cracked frame on a Colt 1911 in under 5k
Front sight shoot off 3 Colt 1911's in under 500 rounds
Never had a Colt 1911 feed HP without a ramp job and barrel
Like 10mm? Don't get a Glock 20 first generations the frame will shoot to pieces and crack in under 1k.
Fixed firing pin S&W revolver snapped right off and don't think for a second I was dry firing it.
Ruger Super Red Hawk main spring broke under 1k
M9's first batch that like to shoot their slide into the face of the shooter.

These are just off the top of my head.

OH then there is the shop VLTOR AR15. What a god for saken POS. What you AR guys see in these POS is beyond me. Give me my FAL any-day. Shoot more then 500 rounds and even in a clean no sand environment you have to strip it down for a cleaning.
Jay Wolf
Pr. Elite Ammunition

"Engineers, the oompa-loompas of science!"

Be'ein Tachbulot Yipol Am Veteshua Berov Yoetz
Image

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 24 guests